TSM Episode 604: The Announcement of Final Fantasy XVI

Unfortunately, it looks less promising than desired.
Final Fantasy XVI has been officially announced.

Download Link: Released 2020.09.21

Caspius and SiliconNooB review the latest Earthbound playthrough updates, consider the announcement of Final Fantasy XVI, weigh in on the unseemly details of the PlayStation 5 event, and prognosticate about the long-term future of gaming hardware.

11 comments

  1. I think of games like Super Mario World and Donkey Kong Country as “Platformers,” Mega Man X and Castlevania IV as “Action Platformers,” and Super Metroid and Castlevania: Symphony Of The Night as “Action-Adventure Platformers.” They’re all platformers in their most basic construction, but action platformers would usually have some weapon-based mechanic, and action-adventurers have exploration built in.

    I think Super Mario Galaxy in 3D All-Stars looks great too. I compared it with the original game being played on Wii U and it’s obviously better. I barely ever played Sunshine, so this collection will really be my starting point for that one.

    Do you think there will be a “Legend Of Zelda All-Stars” next year? And what games would go on it? Personally, I would think the 3DS upgrades of Ocarina Of Time and Majora’s Mask, and the WiiU upgrades of Wind Waker and Twilight Princess. But good luck on something that obviously easy to sell. Alternatively, a version of the original Zelda (a.k.a., The Hyrule Fantasy) made like the recent Link’s Awakening remake would be nice.

  2. There are actually enough 3D Zelda games to where Nintendo could release Zelda All-Stars Vol 1 and Zelda All-Stars Vol II.

    Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask, and Wind Waker in the first volume, and Twilight Spirits and Skyward Sword in the second. Not sure whether they will do this tho, or whether they will just pick the 3 most popular games…

  3. @SN: Twilight Spirits? Surely you mean Twilight Princess!

    All podcast teasing of SN aside, here are some details about how we generally classify games according to the House Style:

    Conventionally, ‘Adventure’ games typically referred to titles like The Legend of Zelda, Seiken Densetsu, and Lagoon (nonlinear, top-down or diagatilt games with equipment, character upgrades, and other RPG elements). Titles like Super Metroid and Castlevania (non-linear platformers) have usually been called ‘Exploration Platformers’ on this site, because ‘Metroidvania’ is a terrible neologism: neither was the first game to pioneer such a design, nor were they even the first ‘major’ titles to do so (see, e.g. Pitfall II).

    Games like Mario are most typically understood as ‘Platformers’ with no modifer (other than, perhaps, ‘3D’), because, at least notionally, their primary gameplay is based on jumping from platform to platform to avoid falling into pits. On the other hand, games like Mega Man are ‘Action’ games (more often now, ‘Action Platformers’ to distinguish them from, e.g., God of War) because they combine platforming in roughly equal measure with action game staples (usually involving a focus on shooting enemies).

    Still other developments have seen a differentiation of the ‘Run-and-Gun’ style game, where the platforming elements are very much downplayed or even absent, and the focus is on moving (usually swiftly) through a stage by continually shooting enemies and moving forwards (Contra is an early example, Azure Striker Gunvolt is a more recent release).

  4. Great podcast Caspius and SiliconNoob!

    I’m with you guys on being trepidatious about Final Fantasy 16. It appeared to look like a single player action rpg, and with news that one of the DMC V developers is working on the battle system. I’m getting a kind of “I like hotdogs, and I like slurpees, but I don’t think I would like a hotdog flavored slurpee” feeling. I think I saw a lot of teleportation swordplay, which brings memories of the shrubbery screened camera experience that was Final Fantasy 15. Granted, it’s still extremely premature, and I’m sure a lot is subject to change. I would prefer they follow the FF7R battle system, because with that it had seemed the stars accidentally aligned and they finally synchronized a good battle system between the action rpg games they’ve always struggled with and the more strategic elements of their more beloved ATB battle systems. However, It looks as if this baby is going to thrown out of the proverbial bathwater with their tradition of going back to the battle system drawing board with every new numbered Final Fantasy release. We may be thinking it couldn’t get any worse than Final Fantasy XV, but that almost sounds like a dare at this point with Square-Enix.

    @Caspius Speaking of Mario Galaxy on Mario 3D all stars, and the rumors of the Skyward Sword Zelda port looming over us like some type of Joker apparition, how are the motion controls of the joy Cons? Perhaps that might be an indicator of how things might be with Skyward Sword, although probably not because the motion controls were more “””””””””””sophisticated””””””””””””.

  5. Hard to port over two-screen (touchscreen!) games to a single screen system without basically redesigning the entire thing around the new system from the ground up; too much work for those titles at the moment.

  6. As I mentioned in the Discord. They should use a mix of 11s Trust system with 12s gambit system. When you go through the story you can meet NPCs that you can program and acquire that have nothing to storywise but can aid you in battle.

  7. @TacticsJack: I am not sure what you mean. 11/12 are FF games. Spirit Tracks/Phantom Hourglass are Zelda games. Adding mechanics from FF games won’t somehow solve the design issues that make SpiritTracks/PhantomHourglass difficult to port to a non-DS system.

    Have you played the DS Zelda games? Taking mechanics from an MMO and a JRPG doesn’t address that in the Zelda DS games Link’s attacks are controlled by drawing paths on the touchscreen, or that the display of those games is spread across two vertically-oriented screens. Ergo, they’d have to be completely redesigned for the Switch, and adding components from another franchise’s totally different games not only wouldn’t solve those issues, it would mean even *more* redesign problems, not less, to include them.

  8. @Fumunshu: I haven’t used the joy-con motion controls, but Mario Galaxy does use the gyros in the Pro controller to direct the pointer/starbit target, and I have to say I find it MUCH better than the original game. Tapping R instantly centres the pointer and it is very responsive to controller gyro movement. With that said, I mostly ignore it except to collect the occasional star bits (it’s almost entirely nonessential as a gameplay component, as you likely know).

    The best thing is that, although you can shake your joy-con to spin (similar to the original Wii title), when using the pro controller you just press Y. This is MUCH better and makes some trickier jumps far less frustrating because the player is not violently shaking their movement device whilst trying to control the character!

    In all three games, I enthusiastically prefer the controls on the Switch to the originals (although the camera in Mario Sunshine remains as infuriating as ever).

    This wouldn’t address Skyward Sword, where the controls and puzzles are based around how you are holding/twisting the sword, and that’s just not possible to do with a pro controller (although perfectly possible with a joy-con). In Zelda, Link’s arm is positionally mapped to the Wiimote, so if your arm is hanging down at your side, so is his; if you raise your arm over head, he holds his up in the same way. If you stick your arm out, so does he. In this way it’s more like VR controls than anything else. And it also follows rotation: so some slots you have to slide your sword into, meaning turning it flat so it slides in, then pushing it in, and then turning your wrist to turn it like a key. All that is done with motion controls, not buttons. And that kind of thing is very common. I’m not sure how it could be remapped onto buttons/joysticks/gyros and still be something PLAYABLE, so they would either have to require joycons (possible on the Lite if the patent for non-mounting joy-cons pans out?) or, edit the puzzles of that sort to ‘autocomplete’ if you approach and press, say, the A button.

  9. I should have mentioned that I was talking about FF16 with the 11/12 idea.

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